Money and Anglimergence in the US of A

[Tim Mathis]

To annoyingly quote myself, at the last national Anglimergent US gathering in California:

"The community...voiced the majority opinion that we don't want to pursue fundraising for an Anglimergent TEC budget organized through the website or through the group that has been meeting at these 'Y'all comes'. This group doesn't want the encumbrances that come along with money from the national church or elsewhere, doesn't have the mechanisms to deal with money in any case, and doesn't feel that a budget is appropriate for this type of conversational, open, networked organization.

However, there was interest in the formation of a discussion/working group to consider questions of 'budget' more carefully. There were strong opinions that contextual mission and fresh expressions of church need to receive wider financial support and resources from TEC (though this didn't seem to be a unanimous opinion). The idea that some form of independent Domestic Mission grant board should be formed, and that some members present at our conversation should be on the board, found some support - so long as that body was a distinct entity from Anglimergent. Karen Ward, Eric Erickson and Tim Mathis volunteered to start a discussion/working group around these issues (and I would invite any/all to join our discussion on this site, which should appear shortly!)."

At this stage in life, I don't have a lot of answers for this one, but/so I do want to throw this on the table for the online community. Any thoughts on how this community might help missioners access needed funds? Or other thoughts around finances and Anglimergence?

[Tim Mathis]

Good question - I'm not going to be there myself, but I'm sure we can come up with a way to communicate about what's happening in Olympia. I'll talk to some folks and see what we can come up with.

[Carol Bradsen]

Great discussion. Thanks for opening it up. The article Tom posted is really good. And the examples of how this is growing on the ground is really good too. I'm with Sara on already having permission. The Holy Spirit is a pretty good leader.

One thing to throw into the mix is how young leaders in the church both carry the vision of emergence and the heavy and cumbersome structures of the church that make it hard. Seminary debt is a rubber hits the road issue. That's true for at least me and my partner. We are limited in time to devote to our ministries due to having to work other jobs to pay off debt.

Our "community of practice," an intentional, ecumenical community of young activists and ministers, is finding a life-giving way to embody a new way. We'd love to offer retreats and classes in the future, but those take time to pull together. Money would help, frankly. We all work and pool our resources to pay the rent and bills and shared food. So if we didn't have to work as much at other, unrelated jobs, we'd have more ability to share what we are learning with others.

Just some quick thoughts before I head off to work.

Thanks, y'all.

[Tim Mathis]

Thanks for the thoughts Carol - I think what you've thrown in the mix is important. We're at a stage now where the value of this work is beginning to work its way into the broader Episcopal consciousness and my hope is that as this happens, emerging ministries will begin to be resourced and supported in accord with their effectiveness. Pioneers and entrepreneurs always bear a responsibility to demonstrate the viability of their startup, but many (most?) new expressions will never have a chance to get off the ground without something akin to a small business loan.

[Bill Stoker]

tim,
"budget" is an issue that usually gets my blood moving rather quickly for a variety of reasons; however, i'm having a difficult time understanding the intent or q's posed. but let me take a look:

a) money for anglimergence
+ is it needed?
+ how much?
+ how is it received?

i think you may find that many might say "yes, it's needed" at least to some extent. i mean, bartering isn't all that common after all. and it would be easy to sit down and come up with a great list of things to do with a budget of any size.

but then the question is "okay, we can do with $X & for $Y, now - how do we get it? any amount other than maintaining a simple community is probably going to require help from others (TEC, etc). truth is, it would probably be easier to have discussions above the parish or diocese level and have a go at it.


b) money from anglimergence
+ how is it allocated
+ are there any other consequences

thing is, it would be a challenge (not unwarranted or impossible) to to say "we" are a group and "we" are doing or quite simply because of the nature of the community.

<>
you've noted the variety of resources available. while i tend to agree, at the local level, i don't think it's the same, as the local resources seem to be too tied up with the parish's operating capital (payroll and building). above the parish level resources are available, i would tend to think.
*but* unless such things become a priority beyond a few individuals, i don't know how successful (again, doesn't mean it's not warranted) seeking will be.

going back to the parish level, i can speak up for years about a variety of ways to intersect the places where we live, work and worship; however, it's often the voice crying in the wilderness of an urban desert.

but...if i can get folks beyond "talking" with me about such things and move into actually fleshing them out, if through regional dialogue, others can start talking and move into fleshing them out....then....

bigger obstacles, from my perspective, again, are not theologically but in practicality. and i have found myself much so an anglican in theology, but much more difficult in practice.

just a few thoughts

[Thomas L Brackett]

Bill,

The tenor of your engaging questions is inviting. Thank you! I hope many more will jump in on this thread -- it's vital. A local Bishop came to me yesterday to say that, during these times of shrinking economies, we need to press each other to expand our Vision. I'd love to continue this thread with the questions and suggestions you offer.

Thanks again, Tim, for starting us down this path.

Tom

[Bill Stoker]

tom
(this first part, maybe a little left of center of the topic, but towards the same mark)

i recall riding through a once expanding part of town here. there was this road, and i mean for like 3 miles it was new development after new/expanded church, after new development after new/expanded church. and all the new residential developments had tons of signs "for sale" from a variety of realtors, and i wondered "how many of those folks are filing or have filed?"

all these huge, beautiful new churches built no doubt as a result of all the new homes, and the people in them, who are either a) now gone into a place they can afford, or b) hanging on by a thread.

i have no issue with beautiful buildings or beautiful homes - but -

people are in real trouble (for a variety of reasons) - and people were heading towards a path of self-destruction. so:

Q) What are the consequences (theological, ethical, etc)? All these churches essentially jumped on the bandwagon of the big "boom", so now what?

Churches don't have the same resources available, because it's all tied up in "real-estate" and "wages" to help the very community of believers that built the beautiful churches and are now finding affordable housing, without jobs, and wondering "what the heck just happened to me?"


So, I would agree, that we need to expand our vision and get the heck out of the very box we created, do so ethically, maintaining consistency with who we are.

now, for a little metaphor
:: systems are systems, but the only way systems change, is if 'management' recognizes, believes, and promotes changes needed. and the one person i believe who illustrated the most profound knowledge of systems is dr. deming. he might say:
+ create constancy of purpose towards tomorrow, and community
+ awaken to the challenges, learn responsibilities
+ stop depending on things that don't help you get where your going
+ drive out fear of change
+ break down barriers between yourselves, and between you and others you're trying to connect with
+ put everyone on the job to accomplish the transformation
+ remember, the most important things cannot be measured

:: so, where does all that take us?
people get comfy, and even after they get comfy - they want more.
how can we, as an anglican community, proclaim the beautiful news and incarnate our faith in a "shrinking economy", in a local (or global) community whose inhabitants have tightened up their belts several times over, who are changing the way they live, how can we if we don't look inward, from the top to the bottom, and change things in our community (even as we maintain consistency) if we cannot truly awaken to the challenges that face us . . . . ?

i'd be willing to say that you present a system (economic, social, organizational, etc) in our community (local to national) and i bet we'd find all kinds of "stuff" that if just tweaked a little here, taken out there, or put in there could make a huge difference. huge.

tom, i'm afraid i have a slight tendency to rant a little bit....i'll try to keep it shorter next time.